Cairo  / Morocco Board News--In Egypt and Sudan female circumcision is still practiced, in Tibet, we are told, one can be cut in pieces  and have the pieces thrown to birds, in East Africa some tribes slice their phallus, in India there are still instances of widows burning, and in Kuwait men shake noses instead of shaking hands… Yet, to be politically correct, some people say ‘’it’s cultural!’’!  But when it comes to a Moroccan overly solicitous general kissing the hand of the young crown prince, no one thinks it’s cultural and many Arabs get to criticizing Moroccan affairs!

If I meet the crown prince Moulay El Hassan or his father King Mohamed VI, I don’t think I will kiss their hands, but no one will cut my head or put me in prison for that! What other Arabs don’t understand or refuse to admit is that we are different and we have different traditions and histories, even if they cross often. Therefore, it’s no one’s business what we do with our 12 centuries monarchy, and if some traditional or old-school-servants to the throne still want to show their allegiance to the royal family by kissing their hands to show respect, it’s up to us to judge them.

We have a proverb in Morocco that says "wait until you have crossed the river and dried your feet to give advice". I will bring up the same proverb for my Arab readers, who just got out of their revolution and who have still their wet feet in the mud of years of oppression, but who have already become specialists in Arab  affairs and have started giving advice and want to export their experience to countries which live in an entirely different context. Some of these people come from countries that didn’t exist on the map 50 years ago, others from places where my father is older than their monarchies, and most from countries to which Nasser exported his military socialist model 60 years ago. No need to say that it’s Nasser’s legacy that the people are revolting against today in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Yemen, Tunisia because apparently the citizens of these countries realized that they prefer a civilian liberal rule rather than a pan-Arabist military one.

Now let’s take the Moroccan example. While Nasser and his clan were mocking our monarchy 60 years ago, we chose another path, a path of gradual democratic transitions, a liberal economy, structural adjustments, strategic partnerships with the West, and a reconciliation process which started long enough to start giving its fruits. Yes Hassan II was a hard father on us. Yes you can call him a dictator in regards to certain decisions he took. But, that clever king saved us from 60 years of ‘’ideological adolescence’’ if we had taken the Nasser path like everyone else in the region.
And now in less than 15 years we had voted for a leftist government, a right wing government and now we are trying the Islamist model, all without any complex and in a mature transitional democratic process that we are internally very critical about!

I don’t pretend my country is perfect. I know better than anyone that it has its weaknesses. We have a young movement which is calling for constitutional and economic reforms called the Feb-20th Movement , which recently made things advance for the better and created a fresh dynamism in the relations between the palace and the people. However, I can't stand lesson givers

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Moroccan Patriot said:

The article is pretty bad Sarah, Your arguments are pretty weak. Morocco has been going backwards for the entire 12 centuries that there has been oppression. In Islam, you are not supposed to put your picture on things that are circulated. You are not supposed to put your picture on money, or have it hanging in stores and Govt. institutions all over the place, because it could lead to people worshiping an individual... or kissing their hand, or bowing or in any way showing unreasonable fealty towards someone. The supposed head of the Islamic faith should be an example to the people of what should be done.

02/11/12

Handy said:

Stunning Is there any person in this world who accept such bow for his fellow human being et another who justify this is it more worse than precedent.

02/08/12

mamoun said:

... @Borsa:"The fall of Muslims in Al Andalus occurred when they departed from true Islamic ideals" Their demise had evidently more to do with power struggle with Christians than any "Islamic ideal". And pray tell what is this "ideal"...is it killing apostates? Is it criminalizing blasphemy? Is it censoring works of art that depict your moon-god in a certain light?

02/04/12

LizardKing said:

Academia.. But I doubt it'll help !! Attributes in line with Barbara Kellermans (Harvard) different types of Bad Leadership. Incompetent Leadership  The leader and at least some followers lack the will or skill (or both) to sustain effective action. With regard to at least one leadership challenge, they do not create positive change. Rigid Leadership The leader and at least some followers are stiff and unyielding. Although they may be competent they are unable or unwilling to adapt to new ideas, new information, or changing times. Intemperate Leadership The leader lacks self-control and is aided by followers who are unwilling or unable to effectively intervene. Callous Leadership Uncaring or unkind. Ignored or discounted are the needs, wants, and wishes of most members of the group or organization. Corrupt Leadership  The leader and at least some followers lie, cheat or steal. To a degree that exceeds the norm, they put self-interest ahead of the public interest. Insular Leadership The leader and at least some followers minimize or disregard the health and welfare of “the other” – that is, those outside the group or organization for which they are directly responsible. Evil Leadership The leader and at least some followers commit atrocities. They use pain as an instrument of power. The harm done to men, women, and children is severe rather than slight. The harm can be physical, psychological or both.

02/03/12

LizardKing said:

... Well well well The cat is out of the bag and the cat may look at the king ! Just ask Caesar! All he was left with is a salad What did Ozzy sing?? Times have changed, times are strange Here I come but I ain't the same Times gone by seems to be You could have been a better friend to me

02/03/12

Sherifian Empire said:

ولتعرفنهم في لحن القول borsa: Attacked or neglected, the hound lolls out its tongue. Reality certainly sucks for the barking mad (especially as a minority), unfortunately there can be no enlightening of those given to conceit and hell-bent on wilful ignorance (which, in their arrogance, they often float as knowledge: Aesthetics without substance). Why waste your time? Regarding mamoun's reckless claim, even Sigmund Freud attributed Jewish achievements to their, free-of-image, belief in God; thus, according to him, leading to the "triumph of intellectuality over sensuality". I very much doubt however that the likes of Nietzsche, S P Scott et al would entirely agree; the most significant achievements might be better read Islamic. http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=rCRL8vVEaT0C&pg=PA212#v=onepage&q&f=false "The land deprived of skilful irrigation of the Moors, grew impoverished and neglected, the richest and most fertile valleys languished and were deserted, and most of the populous cities which had filled every district in Andalusia, fell into ruinous decay; and beggars, friars, and bandits took the place of scholars, merchants and knights. So low fell Spain when she had driven away the Moors. Such is the melancholy contrast offered by her history." - Stanley Lane-Poole "خذ العفو وأمر بالعرف وأعرض عن الجاهلين" Morcelli: "Il n'est nullement blamable et il est meme recommande d'embrasser la main d'autrui par respect pour son ascetisme, sa piete, sa science, sa noblesse, sa retenue" (Imam Nawawi) Naturally of course, every deed is marked by its intention; but undoubtedly, you already know that. Wassalam. "نرفع درجات من نشاء وفوق كل ذي علم عليم"

02/03/12

HKR said:

Never by hatred is hatred opposed to my detractor I say this: Knowledge is an enigma, it can at times be found in lowly places. The overriding vibe that your lines exude -beside their intended fogginess in parts!- amount to little more than blind anger. Well excellent,in such cases a reaction of any kind is better than inertia. it rids the subject of the misty affliction. I pay no mind to what is said in anger, a maxim that served me well along the years. Furthermore, it is worth investigating... when the mist of anger descends, the culprit is usually closer to home than we think. On a curious note, though, for someone who seems to know his way around Plato -one would think- that you would be more than capable to argue your point, without recourse to gratuitous invective. I leave you with the words of Isaiah Berlin: "The first people totalitarians destroy or silence are men of ideas and free minds." apologies one and all for - and this time "inanely" - hogging this space.

02/03/12

man en blanc said:

Voluntary, mandatory, who cares? We are not born yesterday. Nothing is voluntary when it comes to the royal palace. Morocco shall remain a sorry-ass nation as long as the absentee landlord, "affectionately" known as M6, (any news about MI through MIV?) is in "charge". Reality sucks guys!

02/02/12

Sarah__ said:

... I think this tradition should stop . we have a huge respect for the king but it's doesn't mean that we should kiss his hand .

02/02/12

Morcelli said:

... Placing a a 9 year old child in an awkward situation made by Hassan II is nothing short of child abuse. Children are supposed to be free, play soccer, bike, and horse around and eat ice cream when they behave. The poor kid looks so nervous, do you think he 's enjoying grown older men jumping to kiss whatever they can grab of him? So much for the moderate king, the king of poor, the educated king.

02/02/12

borsa said:

... @Mamoun "Science flourished in Al Andalus in spite of Islam and not because of it" if it wasn't for the righteous Muslims of Al Andalus there would not be any civilisation in the first place. Your statement is wrong on so many levels I suggest you go read up on Islamic history and this time please avoid reading revisionist Christian "Reconquista" historical accounts this time. The fall of Muslims in Al Andalus occurred when they departed from true Islamic ideals and pursued a path of sectarianism and tribalism.

02/02/12

LizardKing said:

... Remember Edward Longshanks in Braveheart?? When he said : " The trouble with Morocco is that its full of moroccans" It is true. This breed is no Scotts. William Wallace, where are thou my son! Come see our Weakhearts "they are so many, we're f...ed"

02/01/12

Haqq said:

Sherifian Empire: Your right about monarchy and colonialism... Your right the monarchy is an institution that survived colonialism. But you have to ask yourself why that is? My answer? Just as some Moroccans are willing to un-Islamically bow down and kiss the hands of the king the "Islamic righteous" monarchy as you pointed out and its makhzen was and is ready to bow down and kiss the hands of its colonial masters. Why is it that with our rich Berber and Arab culture and history we are forced to learn and speak the language of another country when a country as small as Iceland has pride in its own culture and language? My point: the monarchy continued to survive ONLY because it was and is being used as a tool to control Morocco.

02/01/12

Haqq said:

To Sherifian Empire It's so funny that you would justify this practice using both Islamic and anti-colonial terms. You just babbled on and on without making any valid arguments for the practice. Let me just say as another brother/ sister has pointed out a Hadith: Anas narrates that none was dearer to the Sahabah than Rasulullah , yet when they saw him, they did not stand up, knowing his dislike for this. (Tirmidhi) This was the humbleness of the Prophet SAW. But why would you even dare bring a Hadith about kissing the Prophet's hand and relate it to the M6 unless you were one of the brainwashed pro-makhzen i***ts who believes that the Alawis were God's gift to Morocco. I know my history, you should read more books and start with "moulay ismael" and look how great and benevolent these holy sherifian rulers have been to morocco for the last few centuries. What you will realize is that every king had a bunch of sheep who believed in almalik, almalik, almalik then alwatan then Allah and no place for the people.

01/31/12

Sherifian Empire said:

ويجعل الرجس على الذين لا يعقلون Among the things I abhor, hypocrisy and inanity dressed as insight. A tongue coated in glitter doesn't make it silver. Indeed, eloquence is a form of sorcery. On that we might agree. But surely a better way to ascertain how advanced a society is would be to pay closer attention to the extent to which the petty things between them develop into big issues. This, of course, does not mean that the sophisticated mortals are forever lending their backs to those unfortunate men with an ear and two mouths, on the contrary, they might often demonstrate the superiority of the listener. "Brothers and sisters, if you and I would just realize that once we learn to talk the language that they understand, they will then get the point." In such societies, you are not called a traitor simply for daring to have a different stance on a particular issue, nor are you called a slave or undignified for disagreeing, least of all for partaking in volitional acts of courtesy and respect. In such societies, much more is done than said and the legless find their feet before they teach others to run. In such societies, each estimation of truth is not proclaimed as absolute, for only the most reckless dare to speak in haste. Thus begs the question: are those who cannot even see past their own nose capable of finding good sense? - "What is it you say it defines as good?" - "Freedom" (The Republic, Plato) Sir, look again. Perhaps you'll agree that we're very much all dependent; the fundamental question however: upon what. "هل يستوي الذين يعلمون والذين لا يعلمون"

01/31/12

Tired Moroccan said:

We need change 20 years ago I am getting sick and aggravated about these people wasting time about stick to the issue, dont attack the person, fight the idea, let's not get personal, we got more pressing issues than kissing the king's hands...etc Its 2012, damn it, we are in deep caca and you are telling me to watch how i voice my rage...there are ignorant people everywhere, people with college degrees yet have no idea what his rights as a citizen his obligations towards his country. Damn it Yes, i want it stopped, be it pass a law or decree or Dahir....No more bowing no more hand kissing Even if the cows,donkeys...want to kiss his hands I dont want it We dont want it. If he was a private citizen i really dont call if all of casablnaca or rabat kiss his hands, but he is the leader of the country and he no longer enjoy that privilge, he is to be criticized or praised based on his abilities as a leader of the country. fact is why should we care what the arabs, europeans or the martians think what we do, its a moroccan issue. These little peolple who dream in french(you know who you are) need to understand something: The train of change is coming you can come and ride aboard for the sake of the country or you can keep resisting but at the end you will lose....that's a promise.

01/31/12

mamoun said:

... @Boursa: Science flourished in Al Andalus in spite of Islam and not because of it. Get your facts straight and stop confusing correlation with causation. It's not just old traditions that are bad, but traditions in general. They're grounded in nothing more than pity tribalism and mindlessly copying others. If a "tradition" can stand on its own merit and its virtues be argued for with sound argumentation in an open intellectual forum (forum != internet forum) it's not a tradition any longer.

01/31/12

borsa said:

... I find some of the reactions to this article a little bemusing. No one forces anyone in Morocco to kiss the Kings hand. If you don't feel like doing it then don't do it, but why get your knickers in a twist over such a small thing? There are far more important issues that Moroccans need to deal with and this certainly isn't one of them. Another note, why do people nowadays automatically assume that old traditions are necessarily bad? After all during the so called "backward" medieval times Islamic peoples were at the forefront of science and technology when these so called "backward" practices were common place. It seems that many of you clearly haven't read up on our illustrious Islamic history and seem to think that history began with the advent of Western industrialisation.

01/31/12

HKR said:

"Chef lakbir dyal la gare sghrir" said NO Among the things I abhor, wanton intimidation and cheap obnoxiousness are high up the list. To ascertain how advanced a society is one must pay close attention to how they debate their current issues. One of the cardinal rules in such endeavour is to always tackle the subject matter never the person, for in such societies the human being is sacred. Another is well summed up in steering clear of the notion that: "He who shouts loudest carries the day." Needless to say that in such esteemed forums, it is downright rudeness, however eloquent its origin, and not humble educational standard that is equated with ignorance. This does not mean that these sophisticated mortals are forever indulging in toothless and anodyne arguments, on the contrary they can be as forceful and as ferocious in driving their viewpoint as anyone, albeit within the parameters of civility and style. In such societies, you are not called a traitor simply for daring to have a different stance on a particular issue, however pointed it may be. In such societies a participant in a given debate, is lauded and encouraged -regardless of the outlines of his or her input- rather than derided and belittled; for it is only through perseverance that comes excellence. On a different note,It is all well and proper to illustrate a point using extracts from our revered religious text when we have objective conviction and common sense on our side; it is a different matter entirely when the person in question views Islam as a mere archive of theological reference to be trotted out when in dire need of a surah or hadith to lend credence to an illogical argument. Finally and in the same vein, mull over this famed and sagacious Omar's address to the lofty governor of Egypt: "When did you enslave people, their mothers gave birth to them free."

01/31/12

Moor212 said:

Kiss or not to kiss I think most of us in this forum agree that kissing hands need to be abolished... It is interesting too see how PJD ministers did not kiss M6's hands, they kissed his shoulder in stead. They bend 15-20 degrees instead of 45 degree. I have to say, that is a remarkable change in the history of modern Morocco. Benkiran him self and Mr. El outmani tapped slightly on M6 arms, while kissing M6 shoulders. Oh yeah they dared to touch his arm, believe it or not.... Since Morocco is about progressive democracy (not immediate democracy), we should focus on reducing the bowing angle by 10% every year, and maybe we can move slight the kissing aria from the shoulders to the forehead, no French kisses!!!

01/30/12

Just a Thought said:

Wake Up I came across this paragraph and thought I'd share. If the enslaved are aware of the fact that they are enslaved, the system is practically unsustainable and there are many good examples in history. The enslaved have strong incentive to rise against their slavers and the slavers have to guard them 24/7. There are big expenses for the slavers just to keep the slaves calm and the system has to break sooner or later. But if the enslaved believe they are free, they have no reason to rise against the slavers, since they don't know there are any slavers at all. Thus the slavers don't have to worry about their safety and all they need to do is to make sure the slaves still think they are free. Such a system is sustainable for eternity. Therefore the people are "more hopelessly enslaved", because there is no hope to be set free. http://wiki.answers.com/Q/ What_does_'None_are_more_hopelessly_enslaved_than_those _who_falsely_believe_they_are_free'_mean#ixzz1kylq9Qs6 “None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free” By Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

01/30/12

In America but not Moroccan said:

to Sherifan Empire Brother, while you say this is a good thing, and people show their love of their dear king, then go on to quote the Prophet (saw), I ask you this: Omar went around in patched up robes and rarely ate meat on account of him not wanting to seem opulent to the followers of Islam, and made sure everyone had food and was warm enough, had water, etc......where does your king fall into that scenario? If he was such a "blessed leader" why is there such poverty in Morocco? Why, when I visit, do I see extremely old people selling peanuts to earn a few dirhams? I think maybe you and your king should spend more time with your head in between the pages of the Qur'an.

01/30/12

Morcelli said:

... 11-09-05, 11:55 AM Sun Sep 11, 2005 9:30 AM BST RIYADH (Reuters) - Saudi Arabia's new King Abdullah has ordered citizens not to kiss his hand, saying the traditional gesture of respect is degrading and violates Islam, Saudi newspapers reported on Sunday. "Kissing hands is alien to our values and morals, and is not accepted by free and noble souls," Abdullah told a delegation from Al-Baha, in southwest Saudi Arabia, who came to the royal palace to offer congratulations on his accession. "It also leads to bowing, which is a violation of God's law. The faithful bow to no one but God." Abdullah became king on August 1 after the death of King Fahd. Thousands of Saudis flocked to pledge allegiance to him in the days that followed, many kissing him on the shoulder or stooping to kiss his hand in a sign of respect and loyalty. But the king, who has a reputation for modesty in a family better known for opulence and power, said only a father or mother deserved such deference. "I announce my complete rejection of this matter, and I ask everyone to restrain from kissing the hands of anyone but their parents," the monarch said.

01/30/12

mamoun said:

mamou@gmail.com "Yet, to be politically correct, some people say ‘’it’s cultural!’’!" No dear. It's not political correctness but moral relativism. Something that was put to rest with the advent of the UDHR. None is more hopelessly enslaved than those who think they're free. And in Morocco's case, there's ample evidence of an authoritarian dictatorship in place. Think about all the portraits of the Royals going around town (reminescent of the world's most abject places). Look at the palace's budget. Check out the fear, uncertainty and doubt in the eyes and hearts of every Moroccan when you discuss the king. Morocco is no exception. These humiliating, quasi-feodal practices were common place not so long ago. The Al Sauds used to subject their...subjects to the same thing mere decades ago. If there were no lese-majeste laws and the public media were independent you might have had a case. But in a land where indoctrination is the norm, I'm afraid that your post is nothing but an mediocre apologist's rant that would go well in la MAP, le Matin or ALM.

01/30/12

__Amine said:

... It really amazes me how could anyone in the second year of the second decade of the 21st century still dare to justify such a humiliating and denigrating act as bowing and kissing the hand of a king let alone his kid. The author tries to justify this scandal by two desperately failed attempts. First she wanted to portray this as if it was a very normal thing for Moroccans to do and that it’s deeply entrenched in our culture and tradition. Well, you already got the answer to that from other participants here, NO Moroccans don’t walk around and bow and kiss the hand of kids nor do any other country in the world as far as I know, and I’ll be surprised if people close to you do this to their kids. Second she succumbs to the ad hominem fallacy. Arab states are bad, so when they tell us that kissing hands is bad this is not true. X is a drug addict so when he says that you should exercise this is not true. You cannot claim that an idea is false just because you don’t approve of the people embracing it. You should prove it by logical arguments instead. Tell us why shaking hands with the king or his kid shows a lack of respect for either of them. If kissing hands was ok for you what about kissing feet? Is it ok too? No? why ? If bowing was ok for you what about prostration? Is it ok too? On another note, I see that the author believes many legends that the autocratic regime has been peddling around for decades using its propaganda machine and exploiting high rates of illiteracy. To name few, Morocco is the best Arab state, some even dare to say that it’s better than Spain and Hassan 2 was a clever and wise king, oh sorry I meant genius and western leaders were taking advice from him. Well I know that most readers of this blog know that it takes a big and proud fool to believe such fairy tales and since I’m running of time here let me just remind you guys that Morocco, the best Arab state ruled by the genius king, ranks 130/187 on the united nations human development index (health care, education, income, etc. and all what matters most to everyone). Morocco is the last Arab country before Irak, Yemen and Sudan. Yes we are bellow Algeria, Tunisia and Egypt. http://hdr.undp.org/en/statistics/ And should I remind you also that there is no human development or inclusive progress under autocratic ruling?

01/30/12

T Riffi said:

Torris said This Practice,should be abolished like Slavery,& Polygamy. Morocco wake up, to the 21 Century, The peoples of Morocco Are smart enough, to lead this Country to Equality,Democracy,& Responsibility.

01/29/12

Sherifian Empire said:

Two Wolves and a Lamb The treacherous M20F and the outside enemies of the Kingdom of Morocco are united in their campaign of slander and defamation, but they're grossly underestimating the resolve of the people of Morocco. Talk is almost always cheap and the caravan moves on: we've long accustomed ourselves to the hatred emanating from our "sister" states who have longer been conspiring to tarnish our repute and topple the Sherifian Empire. (I suppose it wasn't enough for them to betray the Ottomans; it's just a shame that a lot of them haven't learnt many lessons from the subsequent, major consequences - including one by the name of Israel.) To be fair, every society has its share of good and bad; and with that in mind, I'm slightly disappointed that we now turn a blind eye to the snakes within our own community - but it really is hard to keep a straight face when the likes of Mr Moron and his 20 Feb cohorts (all 70 odd thousand of them) parade themselves as the "voice of the 'youth'" and then have the cheek to make comical requests demanding that others "not talk in the name of all Moroccans". Just a small suggestion to Mr Moron and all the other "Morons" out there: Pay closer attention to how we, the ordinary Moroccan, embrace our dear King whenever and wherever we meet him (may God protect him and give him victory). 9% mean anything to you? If not, ask Quel. Haqq you may also want to do a little study and find out who actually established our parliamentary system of government and for what purpose. Honestly, you social rejects are in no position to talk to us about dignity (a state of being which is essentially self-contained; but I do sincerely hope that one day you'll manage to find yours) and liberty (and I highly doubt that you parroting demagogues are even capable of providing a definition); it's enough that you're enslaved by your debt, wage, ignorance, inferiority complex, lusts and the influences of those who manage "public relations" and your many shallow senses. The kissing of the hand is actually a universal practice (trivia, assuming you don't get out much): Widely recognized as both a gesture of respect and a great act of humility, it long became part of Moroccan tradition upon the arrival of Islam. I personally take great joy from the fact that the majority of Moroccans are not yet arrogant enough to renounce this form of greeting nor look upon it in such a negative light; may God protect us from the diseases of the heart. حدثنا أبو بكر بن أبي شيبة حدثنا محمد بن فضيل حدثنا يزيد بن أبي زياد عن عبد الرحمن بن أبي ليلى عن ابن عمر قال قبلنا يد النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم It really doesn't surprise me though that the wretched lot have found find error here, but as the Prophet SAW said: "Can I put mercy in your hearts after God has removed it from them?" For the benefit of the ignorant folk within MENA, bear in mind that unlike the rest of yours, our rule isn't actually the product (direct or otherwise) of colonialism. I do apologize for us having historicalness and for our "thawrat al malik wa sh3ab". http://lamppostproductions.com/files/articles/caliphate.pdf Oh khawana, would you ever complain about the King kissing our heads during his frequent visits of us in the sick-bay? More pressingly, when will you petition against cheek kissing between friends and strangers (which unlike the aforementioned practices is certainly not a sunnah); or who am I kidding? Those doing the best part of the barking are the same lot campaigning for us to eat openly during ramadan, for homosexuals to be openly accepted and for the call to prayer to be muted. Ah, the irony of professing relativism and yet still finding argument. I suppose the part that really frustrates you warped individuals is that our gesture is made out of choice. Perish in your rage. Allah ynsor sidna. "إن الذين أجرموا كانوا من الذين آمنوا يضحكون" "فاليوم الذين آمنوا من الكفار يضحكون" (By the way Sahrane, those with low self-esteem generally tend to be choleric and overly critical, and it might help you to see a therapist; alternatively, with a few adaptations to accommodate the "laughing stocks" and "enslaved" people of the Western world and beyond, you could always perform your piteous rant in London's infamous Hyde Park corner... sympathy might even win you some much needed support.) http://www.abbaswatchman.com/Pope hand kiss = Chavez.jpg http://media.monstersandcritics.com/galleries/1159688/0131633550085.jpg http://wiki.arcs.com/images/velayat-e_faqih/ahmadinejad_kissing_hand_of_khamenei.001.jpg And finally, let's "amuse" ourselves by ridiculing all the weird costumes, rituals, bowing and servitude on display during ever state opening in the United Kingdom, enjoy: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xddba0

01/29/12

Morcelli said:

... Please allow me to say that when I read NORA FITZGERALD, I feel happy and revived. The same feeling you get when you get a nice neck and shoulder massage. Please don't ask me how I feel right now.

01/29/12

Hafid said:

MR When I first saw that video of hand kissing I felt I wanted to vomit of disgust, this the 21st century not the middle ages... Morocco must change now...

01/29/12

Haras said:

waw... I don't remember many articles that were trashed in this way, and I just don't see why?? Where is the disagreement? is it about the kissing, I don't think the author is advocating it, far from that, she has been clear that she would not kiss the king's (or his son's) hands and she even called the people doing it "some traditional or old-school-servants to the throne still want to show their allegiance to the royal family by kissing their hands" Where is the disagreement? since she is just defending the fact or the idea, that the discussion or the judgement on this issue, should be a Moroccan matter, just the same way that Moroccan media and commentators do not generally pick on other dysfunctional habits in other countries, like female circumcision, one of the examples she used. When it comes to the royal protocol, I think we all agree that there is a lot to review, especially the ceremony of allegiance, but for the hand kissing, I think it is up to the individuals to make their choice... since there is nothing in the law, the constitution, or the protocol, to compel people to kiss (or not to kiss) the king's hand... People who see in the article a "plaidoyer" for hand kissing, need to read it again, if they still think the author is defending it, they need to go back to school, or maybe just move to another article... she is just pointing that this is a Moroccan matter and should be discussed between Moroccans... I wish one day I will read people's comments where they discuss the ideas rather than taking the low road of personal attacks, name calling and sometimes, plain insults... Allah Ya3fou 3lina...

01/29/12

man en blanc said:

She opened the window and the wind scattered the remaining vestiges of common sense... Sarah! Was it the recent blessed event in your household or revolution fatigue after a year of turmoil in Egypt that made you write this spectacularly out of touch article? You are defending hand-kissing AND Hassan II? why stop at the exacta? The first one is a no-brainer : kissing the hand of a kid or a monarch is wrong. Case closed. And Hassan II? a monster by any definition! He kept Morocco poor, illiterate and backward through unspeakable cruelty while getting stinkingly rich himself and his acolytes. This doesn't seem like the Sarah we know and occasionally love. I can think of a certain contributor who might have usurped the name of the author; It sounds like something he might write.

01/29/12

Paul Hu Li said:

The Monarchy and Marocco As potential investors to Morocco we see the stability of the Monarchy there crucial. His Royal Highness King Mohammed V1 th is understanding and both He and His Government has recognised that the problems in the Other North African Countries to the East of Morocco have been brought about mainly as a result of lassaize faire politic which allowed the ruling clique to gain a mastery and stranglehold on those Countries. The raising of salaries above their historical lows is a good move and one which I have seen posted in the European Press in the journal EurActiv newsletters is the one where Genesyst UK Limited is following through and is bringing to Morocco the Genesyst UK Ltd Waste to Ethanol process. This proposal which is being rolled out across Morocco in the next 10 years intends to create over 20,000 permanent new jobs in Morocco as well as reduce its dependence on importing oil. This idea shows how the Country could benefit. And with the instigation of a concerted effort (that was brought about as a result of the MENA (Middle East and North African) initiative - driven by Morocco as a trade area and in the Mediterranean EU Trade zone the investors which I have seen coseying up with the World Bank and the EIB for Morocco in this clever initiative by Genesyst UK is what we as investors welcome. Morocco must not lose out to such an issue.

01/29/12

tired moroccan said:

You got some Nerve saying (We) & (Us) You got some Nerve saying (We) & (Us), i am a moroccan a muslim moroccan living in the US since 1984, open minded college graduate, what you may call Americanized moroccan ...I pay no mind to what our arab friends say about us,but i tell this: i am and have been and always will be againt hand kissing, paint it dress it however you like it is : Slavery.If some moroccan chose to do that then he/she is a *?*X> i***t, and deserve to be treated such, no respect no even an acknowlegment . You spoke of old proverb to tell the world that only morocans understand moroccan affairs...well my dear there are moroccan and there are moroccans, just like there are males and there are Men..dont you dare tell me that hassan II was a genuis in leading morocco for some 30 years, 30 years of corrupt hypocricy and self condescendance ....A country that is supposed to be :arab yet every breathing soul speaks pig french,muslim yet most people couldnt explain a small Surah, Proud yet most women go to Gulf region make a living on their backs, dream big yet every kid younger than 17 dreams of immigrating to europe instead of acing high school, and the corruption its part of the air we breath, a country that have perfected Knowledge complacency (most dont want know stuff and they dont CARE to find out)...Speaking of traditions, someone who earned the privilge to be called [ ومـــا خلقناك الآ رحمة للــــعالمين] you would think someone with that status,people would kiss his hands and feet AND yet he made sure of it that no one did it...other than your parents and grandparents no one i repeat no one, no king his father his son should have their hands kissed or bowed to. We were in the dark because of our rampant ignorance, almighty God sent Our prophet to deliver us, we lived in Splendor & Glory(العز) and then we lost our ways and recently we strive and compete for Humiliation(الذل)...To be honest i cannot believe come to the US, to study or work with that mentality? it is utterly Against the principles of this great country: Question Authority ... don't kiss its behind...you brown noses.

01/29/12

MORON said:

NOT ON MY NAME PLEASE I could not finish reading this article, Please when talking or publishing, do not talk in the name of all moroccans. Moroccan people are not all slaves...

01/29/12

Traditionalist said:

Good article I broadly agree with the article...we should embrace our traditions and not simply copy the others. Our history shows that it has worked! The emotional comments on the article do not add much as they are simply very far from the reality. Yes, Morocco has poverty, corruption and is not free but please put things in perspective. On poverty, the country scores much better than many Arab countries (especially the non-oil producing ones). On corruption, things have slowly been improving and the reality is that today's economy is not more in the hands of one person or family. On freedom, I would advise everybody to travel to the other Arab countries and see for themselves. One final note on the kissing of the hand...kissing the hand of kid goes too far but I am not against kissing hands of elders. It is a simple sign of humility and showing respect. Values which we forget in a world where everybody thinks he is a "God"

01/29/12

xmas said:

ritual humiliation People that abase themselves by submitting themselves voluntarily to ritual humiliation need to get educated. Mohammed VI is one of the most obscenely rich individuals in the world and gets richer every day off the back of ordinary Moroccans. His massive companies are at the centre of the Moroccan economy but it's a model that only benefits the privileged - and above all the royal family. Highly-qualified Moroccan youths, of whom the vast majority have no money or influence to bribe anyone to get themselves a job, are left to rot and set themselves on fire in protest at a massively unfair system. Corruption in Morocco is endemic and prevents any kind of real progress. The political parties that are allowed to exist are all controlled by the king and even the latest government and "reforms" have the heavy hand of the palace all over them, let's not be naïve. The real power stays with the Makhzen, nobody who knows anything about Morocco would seriously contest that. Those who want to see Moroccans fulfil their real potential - and they have loads - would do better to get up off their knees, wipe their obsequious lips and tackle the real problems rather than letting their country be systematically pillaged by the corrupt and cynical ruling class, headed by the king and his son.

01/29/12

YAH said:

Lol In rome they kiss the Pope feets so leave morocco alone because they do it and want it.

01/29/12

mbt said:

Shame, Shame, Shame This is no culture by any measure. If there was any excuse to get rid of the king it is this, the kissing of hands of young lad smacks of slavery and slap in the face of Moroccans. The king should be ashamed and those kissing this child's hand should be lined up and shot. How many of those kissing this lad's hand have visited orphonages and cuddle an innocent orphan child? We should all be ashamed.

01/29/12

HKR said:

Misplaced pride An act is generally deemed right or wrong, or at any rate, acceptable or otherwise only as far as the reason/s behind it is considered steeped in rational thinking or not. I borrow the examples from the article to illustrate: one may think female circumcision backward and benighted on the premise that such practice serves not the well-being of the girl involved but the narrow minded world-view of the relevant society. In the same token, sky burial in Tibet makes perfect sense once one is presented with the reason behind it: namely the impossibility of digging conventional graves on account of the nature of the rocky mountainous ground. It is an undisputed fact that human gesture and gesticulation are universal. There is a certain uniformity to body language that transcends ritual norms, nationality and speech. A whole art form -mime- is built around it, a medium through which all human emotions, however subtle, can be expertly conveyed and readily understood. In light of what has just been said, it is completely understandable that from an outsider's standpoint where the Kuwaiti nose rubbing might come across as overly affectionate and comically bird-like; our royal protocol of hand kissing, I am sad to say, at times carries the connotations of utter submissiveness and abject obsequiousness. Having said that, I am the first to concede that life is not a silent film. Far from it, it is infinitely loud and rambunctious to a degree that any given act can be explained away in a million and one way: it is called context and in the absence of reason there lies the devil. Finally, it is in the realm of the impossible to control how others view us; it is , however well within our reach to shape our own behaviour. therefore if the issue at hand here is the unfavourable outside reaction to such practice, we are better advised paying it scant attention. On the other hand if said protocol annoys us specifically, we ought to call for its abolition - a matter easily said than done , I am only too aware- or at least have the decency to denounce it for the travesty it is, rather than fervidly trying to excuse it under the banner of context or the guise of tradition.

01/29/12

S Hassi said:

Why not kiss his A*** too Our beloved King just enjoys to see his subjects humiliated in a most degrading manners from pointing hated corrupt thieves as his advices to keeping this Mafia tradition, he just like to act as the Godfather and AL capone (he never pays any taxes ). By sending his little Kido to be paraded like the little Ramesis is not doing him any favours ( according to some psychology experts ) this kido may safer from some psychologic problems later on in life( this remind me of Hassan 2 THE GREAT !!!). In my opinion the King is pushing his luck and soon will be toooo far . A true Moroccan can only kisses his parents hands and the king has to earn the respect, in my opinion he is losing what left of it. We should start a NO HAND KISSING PETITION . Regards from Tetouan

01/29/12

SAHRANE said:

i cannot mince my words Are you kidding me?this is the most absurd explanation/excuse for the slavery mentality and the country rip off ,i've ever heard in my entire life and , you should be a shame of yourself giving that nonesense ,trying to give a cover to a regime who slaves people and shame us around the world ,make us look like i***ts and laughing stock cause we're infortunate to belong to a country where poeple don't have a spine to stand up to slavery ,you call it culture ,gimme a break, what you expect? we should be gratefulf to the king and his cabal for leting moroccans kiss not only his but his son hands, a shame on all of you slaves ,no self esteem no dignity.

01/28/12

Haqq said:

... By attacking Jamal abdelnasser your not making your argument for kissing the hands of the young monarch on the contrary your argument remains weak and in all reality shows how you should never write again. I am Moroccan and I know my culture and I say this practice is sick and should be abolished. Don't attack the Arabs who point out such degrading oppression enlighten us on how kissing a child's hand is beneficial for Morocco, because I can give you a million reasons why it is harmful to our Moroccan society. I am from the North ask us what we really think of this tradition...

01/28/12

Haqq said:

s****dest article I have ever seen..... It doesn't matter who is making the argument whether it is Arabs, Moroccans, Europeans, Americans or the Chinese the fact of the matter is that kissing the hands of a monarch whether he be 8 or 48 years of age is an insult to Moroccans and is a perverted act that is universally wrong. The leader of a country should work for the people not the other way around. You assume that Moroccans wish to kiss the hands of the young monarch when in reality the only people who want to kiss his holy alawi hands are you and the corrupt government ministers who plunder and pillage the country throughoutThis article defending the practice makes me sick.

01/28/12

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